Strange ignition miss in low gear only...traction control?...you decide..

Discussion in 'System One Pit Buzz' started by Will Hanna, Nov 2, 2010.

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  1. lucky devil

    lucky devil Member

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    Personally I wish I had the budget for TC , at the moment my right foot does just that. Rightly or wrongly , this is a very interesting subject , it would make great Tv thats for sure.

    Wayne Nicholson UK www.luckydevil777dragracing.com PM777
     
    #61
  2. darkpino

    darkpino New Member

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    I think i'd agree with Robert, it's not fair to put this on internet before telling the Haberman's personally about your suspisions...

    But that's just my opinion.

    You don't only put the Haberman's in a bad light, but also the European Dragracing.
    I think 5 years ago there we're talks of dropping TAD from the FIA tour, now finally it all lived up and this stuff comes up...
     
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    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
  3. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    one more day

    I have no intentions besides what were stated in my original post.

    I think this thread is reaching or has reached the point of it's usefulness. Points have been made on both sides. I will allow this thread to stay up until Sunday evening, then I will close it. So if anyone plans on commenting, do so before then.

    I think dialogue needs to continue in reference to traction control, just in it's own thread.
     
    #63
  4. rb0804

    rb0804 Member

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    The traction control needs an input if it is hidden or not right? Is it possible to use the same driveshaft sensor or is an additional one required? Just thinking if you see a car with two sensors something may be up?
     
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  5. badbird

    badbird New Member

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    they dont need two sensors
     
    #65
  6. rb0804

    rb0804 Member

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    then the one sensor would have a branch in it right? Maybe the rules should state that any drive shaft, clutch or any other 'speed' sensor used should be in plain view (away from other wires directly to the datalogger box), with minimal amount of connectors and available for inspection at the discretion of the sanctioning body? Will is probably correct in that you will not be able to find the actual chip that does the controlling, but you may be able to pick up the 'triggers' and go from there.
     
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  7. Fuel Cars

    Fuel Cars AA/AM

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    I really like this site but sorry Will, you handled this wrong in my opinion.

    Even if you had indisputable evidence, and you don't, publishing an accusation on the world wide web without at least talking to the accused is not right.

    If you wanted to have dialog about TC then start a thread just about that and present the videos as questions only.

    Now, the main dialog is about taking sides and I don't think anybody really wants to in the middle of that.
     
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  8. mark6052

    mark6052 Member

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    Next Week

    stay tuned for Will Hanna and Geraldo Rivera open the tuning vault of Frankie Manzo. :rolleyes:
     
    #68
  9. chopperdan

    chopperdan New Member

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    Share your scams here.....maybe we can learn from other's scams...
    Here's a chance for some of you that may have been scammed, heard of scams, or avoided them to post your stories.

    There will be one strict rule: NO NAMES MENTIONED! DON'T EVEN ELUDE TO SOMEONE!

    Maybe we can use this to save someone else the grief. Also a good place to list the safest ways to exchange money on used parts.

    AS ALWAYS, COVER YOUR ASS!
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    First of all, I really like this site and I hate to see this kind of thing happen. What I don't understand is that we are not allowed to mention any names, or elude to someone that has scammed or ripped us off. But it is ok to accuse another of cheating and stealing without 100 percent indisputable evidence. By stealing I mean that if someone were cheating then that person is also stealing the victory and prize money. I view this as a double standard. I just think that this entire episode was handled wrong. I'm not saying who is right or wrong here but more facts should have been gathered, before any accusations were made, than just relying on a video. I hope that this gets straightened out and we get back to what this site was intended for. Thanks for a great site.
    chopper dan ----- Dan Beard, St. Louis, Mo.
     
    #69
  10. Reeves Racing

    Reeves Racing New Member

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    What the heck ?

    This thing had 8,791 people look at it as of now. WOW!! What if i had posted something like read your bible this morning or God loves you? How about Jesus saves? How about everyone stop the yapping and pray for gods will be done in this matter? Ya know drag racing is suppose to be fun , isnt it? Dont we go to the track to have fun? I will tell you i have enough troubles out in the world, dont you ?Give youre heart to christ, read youre bible and LETS RACE AND HAVE FUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!God Bless, CLAYTON REEVES ps. I do love this site will , Thanks
     
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  11. enzo

    enzo 5.500 & 270

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    Blaah.

    :p F*ckin aye they say in UK.

    We also must drop a slice here to get cheap publicity. Remember TMD/AFD 4618, no sponsors, no tuners, no food. Fuck your hitek.
    -Cheap in any angle. Find out also that english is not the normal language, except in UK, Australia, US etc. Most european racers are not very good on english, some fellows speak NOT AT ALL!
    -It will be very difficult to take part for this conversation, or try to speak without getting through with interpreters, or crewpeople who are skilled enough with english.

    I will stay easily in the middlefield. I hate cheating and whining.. And in all means try to win someday you all. All TAD/TMD racers and crews are somehow good guys in Europe. "Choose your side" <-Ridiculous. I have a life and 2 nights before early flight to Pomona to try to get cheap junkyard parts.

    You can watch a video that helps on something: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTpSItforgY
    -Then when million people has bought these records, guys will pay my racing, nice.

    Timo is a very nice guy, started his "big gun career" with mine and Arto´s old camel, he´s not as nice as I am, but still we fit to the same sidewalk naked or not. Having dare to be different racecars and not giving a shit what bastards think behind the back with a little beers.
    -Still if I would see funny wires in that car, Timo would look like a panda. So far didn´t.
    -I heard all the whining and did we look. Yes. Pay the fee, inspect wires and / or shut up.

    And yes, I didn´t agree all with Werner and still don´t on how those cars should be made on fuel, or ignition, could be done better, like hirpm richeners etc (revised hispeeds), putting a 6-shooter or digital etc to stay out of blowing tires and shakes that hop the blower.
    -Werner was a champion on alkycars when I was a preteen at late 70's...

    And Will + some others was first thing 2009 Santa Pod opening making rules to downgrade Whipplecars oversping. Now it´s nice, impossible to make by 13.9 and 14mm blower pulleys. Thankyou, I still have a Whipplecar too. And that will go fast when we find driver. (Yes, Bob´s both records and championships winning chassis cars are waiting here for a good day too).

    Then what comes to performance. Remember one thing. I´m short of money and don´t get partshelp, not much tuning advices for A-Fuel, been learning it only 1.5 years with my special boys, we all know that with a slightly better economy or other stickers in my missile we will sweep the tincan table, took European Records back to garage where they belong and no matter how millionaires you are and how smart ass tuners with your latest digital bells and whistles you have, we will together with our museum racecar kick your ass so far around planet that you don´t find them anymore.
    -No matter who you are and with what equipment, I dont cry your reactiontimes, or whatever.
    -Meanwhile before new kids come to games, you all can admire my fat ass and homemade looking junkiemuseumcar.
    -It´s still only 4 sec A-Fueler in Europe. (Ofcourse on bit outlaw IHRA tricks, ehh).

    I will find that missing one tenth on 60ft. Then it´s goodbye. To all of you dear fellow racers.
    -Ofcourse you rotten politicians go whining that we should have 26octane fuel..
    -So what, you know what wormholes you are, and still I like you on god days..:rolleyes:

    We live in Europe, I´m fat, stupid, ugly, sometimes fast, girls like me, I can talk whatever I want really, very handsome and politically correct. You are allowed to disagree, lets chat behind trailer.

    I´m a messenger of finnish Heavy metal music and I hate everything. Not only these postings. It means everything.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 7, 2010
  12. f.m.s.

    f.m.s. New Member

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    I’m writing this on behalf and in the name of the whole Werner-Habermann-Racing-Team.​

    This is in no way a confession, (sorry to all of you who still think we are cheating or just think we are using any kind of a device which could work as a TC. legal- illegal or non-traceable).
    I don’t think that any of you who keep this thread up and interesting on the World-Wide –Web realize how it harms the TMD Racing in Europe and maybe even in the World.

    It is hard for us to believe that there were rumors going around for quite a while as we thought that all our fellow racers would stand up for themselves and come and talk to us if they had any doubts about us or our cars. -Obviously they did not.-

    We were wondering in September after winning the Championship for Timo and became Vice-Champion with Dennis why only very few Racers came over to congratulate these two young men and their Team for their achievement. -Now we know-.

    After long discussions inside the Team we will now give all of you the chance to prove that you are wrong with your accusations. As we don’t see any reason for us to prove anything as we haven’t done anything wrong except running safe strict to the Rules and do that as fast as we can.
    This will not help Timo or Dennis to feel any better afterwards because their pride of being champions has been destroyed by all these accusations and discussions.

    This is our offer to all of you Racers or Tech people who have any doubts of us running a legal Racecar without any kind of TC or ignition system which works as such.

    • Come and talk to us and look at the Car, we will gladly explain any piece of wire or anything going anywhere on the Car.
    • If you think our tach is the secret weapon, bring us another one stay with us while we put it in the car and until we run the car. (Just make sure you bring one with a reset Button because Timo has a bit of a routine which could put him off if there is no Button to press 3x.)
    • If you think any part of the 44 Amp MSD Ignition System is our secret weapon then please bring one and we will put it in the car and run it.
    • If you think our Data logger is the cause, we will take it out and run the car without (non competition runs only as we are aiming to win the championship again and therefore we use our data)
    All this could have been arranged at any Racetrack of your choice after talking to us, but no you all thought it’s better to talk behind our back. So this is a chance for you all to prove you’re wrong. Because we haven’t done anything wrong therefore we don’t have to prove anything. The only thing we are going to prove to you is that we will fight for the Title in 2011 just as we did in previous years, fair without cheating and with sportsmanship.

    We know that the damage done to the Name of Werner-Habermann-Racing by this thread and all the discussion can’t be compensated in any way, so the only small thing to satisfy us is to look into all your faces when you realize what you have done to the Sport, to Dennis, Timo, Werner, Heidi and all of Werner-Habermann-Racing after we proved you’re wrong and still go fast and still kick a...

    Off the Record:

    If some expert out there thinks’ that we created some kind of a Terminator to run a TMD being able to pull 0,000- light’s on the Tree, please come and talk to us and we will prove that it is Dennis or Timo without anything planted in their Brain to do so, before you post anything on the WWW making a fool out of yourself.

    It is a fact that the two brothers’ are the quickest on the tree and very consistent in their performance and that’s why we win.

    We don’t have the quickest neither the fastest cars in the field. But for sure the best Drivers and a perfect Team, and that’s how you collect Points and win a Championships, like it or leave it, it's a fact.

    Frans M. Steilberg

    Asst. Crew Chief and proud member of the Championship winning Werner-Habermann-Racing-Team
    Tech. Inspector for Dragrace-Cars certified by the DMSB/FIA and the SFI-Foundation.
     
    #72
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2010
  13. JP

    JP Member

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    Sir

    You had made a beautifull and respectfull post stating your thoughts and beliefs until this remarks, its be these kinds of words that put doubt in my mind

     
    #73
  14. TMD Fans

    TMD Fans New Member

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    After following this thread for the past five or six days, we as European Drag racing fans have decided to add our opinion to all of this.

    We are European Drag Racing Fans and have been following drag racing for many years in Europe and Stateside. The few races we have here have cost a lot of Blood, Sweat & Tears by many people to get it where it is today.

    We find your accusation against Timo and the Habermann family & team appalling. They are a credible family in the field of Drag Racing for over 30 years and more. Their dedication and devotion to the sport is applaud able. Timo and Dennis were born into the sport and we have watched them grow from racing Junior-dragster to what they are today. They work hard all year round researching, watching footage from previous races, working on their cars to better themselves. Their hard work has obviously paid off for the past years, much to the disgust of you Mr. Hanna and your followers. Why can you not accept, that hard work, motivation and dedication will also bring you glory. What we have here is a combination of *Great Cars, the Best Drivers, hard work and a great Team.
    Not many people liked Michael Schumacher either when he was winning consecutive years!!!

    Our questions to you ;

    1. Why did you not have the courage to protest after qualifying when there would be enough time to do so? No you had to wait until the Atlantic Ocean was between you and the Habermann´s and then accuse them of cheating, here in Europe we call that cowardly!!!!

    2. Why did you not wait until the 2011 season and put in a protest?

    3. Is your heart really in the sport? As we here in Europe have to fight for everything we have in the field of drag racing which makes us think with you it is all about $$$$. We are sure you are not flying to Europe for Love!

    What you have done here is taken the spotlight off of Timo & Dennis and put it on yourself, as you are a bad looser and have to justify you lack of knowledge on tuning the car you’re looking after. We saw that car run this year, in our eyes…you were a failure. Why can you not accept that, go do some research and do better next time. It would have been far more intelligent for you to befriend the Habermann family and learn from them.


    Timo & Dennis you are and will remain our Champions. Keep up the good work!!!
    We wish you & your Team all the best of Luck for 2011.

    Fans of TMD-Dragracing
     
    #74
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2010
  15. Dave Germain

    Dave Germain New Member

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    Cheating

    I think one of the reasons this post was made originally is because cheating does exist. I am not here to defend Will Hanna nor am I here to accuse anybody in Europe or the US of cheating. Over my years of racing I do know of cheating, it does exist. I have seen it in the bracket classes clear up to the Pro Stock classes. Sometimes the only signs of it are a team that is just a little "too good". Maybe thats what people in this situation are thinking? Maybe the team in question just seems a little "too good " to the other teams and folks watching them? I don't know, I wasn't there. But I do know it has happened before here in the US and if it could happen here it certainly could happen anywhere. Dave Germain
     
    #75
  16. eli

    eli Banned

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    Dose this happen on all runs to the same cylinder? If it does mybe they have 30lb.or more check valves in 7 of there port nozzles?
     
    #76
  17. marklee

    marklee Blown Alcohol Dirt Drags

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    Right Or Wrong

    10121 views and 75 reply's...Everyone seems to want to throw Will under the Bus. But from the Videos its mighty hard too Believe This was Coincidence..( Ray Charles could see that )...

    Mark Lee..
     
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  18. tafccrewguy

    tafccrewguy New Member

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    This is true...even with evidence ,this is wrong. If Will is right,he can say I told you so ,but big deal.
     
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  19. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    cowardly?

    Cowardly? Really?

     
    #79
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2010
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