NHRA's weight on the A/Fuel cars

Discussion in 'System One Pit Buzz' started by Wendland, Oct 9, 2003.

  1. Scott Nelson

    Scott Nelson New Member

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    "It's not my position.....It's NHRA's."

    - Rob Wendland

    Smokey, now can you see why I asked Rob the question?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
     
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  2. Scott Nelson

    Scott Nelson New Member

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    Rob,

    I don't know if it is funny or not that we can only come up with a few oil downs from the AFD's. What we were trying to point out is the AFD's also have their problems. I don't really care what broke on the Miersch car. A clean up is a clean up, it should be counted. Simple as that.

    What is really funny is that this all started as a PARITY ISSUE and now we are discussing oil downs. This is starting to look like an election campaign. One side realizes that they have no argument regarding an issue, so they change the subject.
     
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  3. Langenhammer

    Langenhammer New Member

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    I'd have to say that happens on both sides there Scotty. By the way, how've ya been dude?
     
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  4. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Scott,

    How much fun can you have in one day....NHRA has stated to me oil downs are a concern in the TAD class...Take it for what it is worth...It more than likely had some affect on their proposed changes or they wouldn't have said anything about it....There's where it ties in-----SCOTT.....Larry's oil down was still his rear end....LOL We here at the shop have taken a small Whipple charger and made a slushy machine out of it..... :D
     
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  5. Scott Nelson

    Scott Nelson New Member

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    Bobby,

    Things have been good. How about you guy's? Hope to see the Billet Bullet Gang out there again soon.

    Rob,

    No $#!t, a slushy machine out of a small whipple?!?! Just think what you could do with a real blower, like the gizmo!!!!! [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
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  6. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Scott,

    You could more than likely open a chain of kwik shops and pump in the slushies from one location. :cool: :cool:
     
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  7. Les Mellows

    Les Mellows New Member

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    Rob , I didn't ask if you would like to spin the cars at higher rpm .I am not NHRA offering you what you would like , I am proposing a rule change that would affect the way you run a fuel dragster and also would comparably affect the blown dragsters . I believe The AFD would in fact slow down with more gear. I think the truth be known that the AFD motors would not enjoy a weekend with 8600-9000 rpm out the back and the gear change would also buffer the initial load at the starting line. Also the BAD combination would not have the ease of 10,200 shifts and 9700 out the back. They would have to change the ratios in the trans to attempt to get closer to where they are now and the trans pack % would increase the shift drops and thus prevent the rpm from staying elevated throughout the run . Remember Rob the goal is a parity between the styles of car not a parity between the participants. The individuals will have to do their homework to get back the optimum performances. Rob I am not implying that there is any large capacity of space to use (I have seen posts from you) , but I think you need to keep an open mind. You seemed stunned and oblivious to the fact that the class needs help in achieving a parity for the fans sake , they do not want to watch a slow top fuel car class ! The sport needs the separate identities and styles and should be encouraged to involve altereds (blown and fuel) to spice up the appearance, the competition, and the fan appeal. But why would I believe that you really care about the welfare of the class ??? you are a follower , not a leader otherwise parity would not be taken as a fuel bashing but instead a challenge to create an exciting racing forum that would appeal to racers , fans and most of all individual and class sponsors. Eventually a potential sponsor will read a forum like this and lose interest in supporting a class that cannot understand the concept of complete UNITY for the sake of all not the few .
     
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  8. Nathan Sitko - 625 TAD/TAFC

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    This isn't a bash on anyone or anything of the sort, just a question.

    We run a blown alky TAD, and we blew up 2 motors this year ((I know it doesn't sound like a lot, but for us it is as we only attend about 10 races a year, which are mostly match races)) - kicked the rods out of both sides on one occasion and didn't leave one drop of oil on the track either time. In fact, the first one we didn't even know about until we got back to the pits and dropped the diaper...and a lot of oil and parts on our pit-area rug. Is this maybe a problem with the engine diapers not being installed properly, or maybe they don't fit right, or not put on tight enough?

    I know ours is for a deep-pan deal and we run a less-deep Dan Olsen pan, so when we install it we tighten the crap out of it...seems to work pretty well seeing as in our car there's 16 qts. in the pan and 3 qts. in the accumulator. I mean maybe it's just me, but if you have a good fitting diaper it really shouldn't let a lot, if any oil get on the track should it?
     
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  9. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Les,
    You sound like this problem just started. I remember in 91' when boggs' brother quit because they hit hit with weight. That was his 4th time. He has never returned either. His brother Steve was beat on then, in the funny car class and now in this class. We are losing people because there is no voting system, you have no rights when you pull in the gate and TAD is just a filler class like all the others.

    Well, as far as not caring where this class goes, your wrong. I have spoke my piece over the last 20 years. Remember, I spent 17 of those years with some type of blown alcohol car in this class. I can't think of a better reference than Vern Moats. Won't you call him and ask him if I have cared or not?

    Everyone has these great ideas to slow, speed, lower, raise every thing in this class. NHRA will not test it though...I say seperate the class.
     
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  10. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Sitko,

    You are right. That stuff we all need to look at real well. If you look at the top fuel class they have an additional skin that goes under the engine to catch what the diaper misses. It's a good idea. We use a bucket and it works well too.
     
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  11. DHE

    DHE New Member

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    I agree with you Rob,they should split the class.And then to address the oil down issues in TA/D,lower the overdrive limit to 85% on the PSI,and the NHRA install a 9500 chip in the mag box prior to each run.Most teams run electronic mags anyway?


    Dale
     
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  12. afuel7438

    afuel7438 New Member

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    I dont normally get involved in posting on these deals, but I dont think that everybody bitching at eachother is the answer. I think both cars have pros and cons, but lets face it they will never be the same. All this site has turned into is one big pissing contest. I am curious to know what all of the fighting is goin to resolve? I hear one guy is thinking about quiting just because of all the fighting. I know Im goin to get shit for posting this, but this class has gotten a bad reputation now, and its all because of this stuff. We are still sportsman racing and we can't forget this is still supposed to be fun. This is my final post on this so please dont bash me.
     
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  13. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    DHE,
    You can't lower the overdrive. This makes them spin them harder. Mark Oswald and I came up with a boost controller that would go in place of one of the burst panels. This would allow every blown car to have the same amount of boost reguardless of how good your blower was, how many RPM you spin it. They would be regulated by NHRA and tested by them.

    Matter of fact, you would take overdrive out of your car, lower shift points and so on. Wouldn't matter what blower you had. We came up with this idea after seeing what the IRL does with their Indy cars. Of coarse this is if the class is seperated. It would be easier on parts also.
     
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  14. 310TAD

    310TAD Top Alcohol

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    And I can make a nice throttle stop for NHRA to install on all the a-fuel cars. LOL

    Have a great day all,
    Marty
     
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  15. DUCTMAN

    DUCTMAN New Member

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    Good idea Marty
     
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  16. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    morgan,

    keep in mind this message board is for discussion of all topics related to alcohol racing. unfortunately the parity issue is a very heated one, and probably the biggest deal right now. it really is a deadlock. i've stated my peice, pretty much everyone has. at this point, its very unlikely many opinions will be swayed from their current positions. we're all awaiting the verdict from nhra, which has pretty much been let out (weight). once that verdict is issued, we all have to deal with it in one way or another. do the blown teams continue to run? how much weight will the a/fuelers have to carry? its all choices and situations we will face. even though i am not real happy with the projected outcome, i am ready to move on from this.

    morgan, thanks for posting, and if you feel like you dont need to post again, thats your deal. i just try to keep this site as open as i can to opinions...
     
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  17. Mr Scary

    Mr Scary New Member

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    Hasn't NHRA made the new rules official?
     
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  18. Fuel Cars

    Fuel Cars AA/AM

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    It's official, Here's the link.
     
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  19. ch3no2

    ch3no2 New Member

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    Blown cars are running in the 20's, (Thacker, Wells), in fact they have been for quite some time, (Santos, Shields).Take a look at the top 10 national point list, 6 blown cars and 4 a/fuelers. It looks more than fair to me. Why is everyone worried about slowing down the nitro cars. Maybe they should just figure out how to go 20's themselves. I know it takes money to go fast in a blown car, but if you think dumping nitro in the gas tank means you instantly run teens your crazy! These guys, (and there are only a few going fast), have worked for 30 years to get somewhat consistant performance. Now people want to slow them down. Well, if you do, how can they compete with Thacker and Wells, (5.25) Maybe you should slow them down, too.
    Besides, NITRO is just really cool shit, and fans love it! Leave them alone!
     
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  20. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    damn this is getting old....

    a few blown cars have ran some .20s in absolute mineshafts. mostly high twenties. mid at best. 5.26 to be exact.

    running high twenties in a mineshaft is a far cry from 5.13 or 5.17. it is also a far cry from the teens and twenties the a/fuelers have run in 2000 ft of air. if you want to argue that all the blown cars CAN run high .20's, all the a/fuel cars CAN run low teens. a few pounds wont narrow that gap.

    anymore bright ideas?
     
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