Indy

Discussion in 'Pit Buzz' started by Wendland, Sep 2, 2003.

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  1. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    There were very little oil downs in Indy so far. Congratulations to all the crew chiefs and crews. There was one lengthy clean up but I can't remember who it was in the last session. This means a lot to NHRA in their efforts to help control oil downs and canceling sessions. Many people have told me how good the last session was along with all the others. It didn't look like there was a real advantage to blown or afuel cars either. Marty had a nice run and had said that it could of been faster if not for the pedal and wheels up deal. I think that a lot of blown guys have some catching up to do with Marty. Marty, you are one driving machine! Nice job!

    One thing though, in your comparisions to events won this year and E.T.s, there are some factors you must consider. The Santos syndrome. When Santos was running so well, people would red light, shake the tires, check out before the tree was activated because he was the car to beat. He won a lot of races just because of that. Everyone would try so hard and then step on their own dicks and sometime lips for our female drivers. The same thing is happening with Bradshaw right now.

    If you take Bradshaw's E.T out of your comparisons, it gets pretty even. That's a fact.
    I just want to thank TARA right away for the gear ratio change that is more than likely going to happen, 3.20. and the fuel percentage to 96% that really is going to fuck up things. Remember, the whine is susposed to be coming from the blower and not your mouths. I know I'm whining too, I don't have a blower, nor could I even buy one thanks to my big mouth and all. What if the blown cars were told that they have to run a 2 speed or direct drive. What's that do to all of your previous infomation or the direction your trying to take your car? I'll tell you and will more than likely tell you in two weeks. TO SHIT! All that information gone.... I don't have the answer, I wish I did. There is not one thing that will fix it all.

    I have been on both sides of this issue. I've been with teams when we had a steel big block w/alum heads and upgraded to a Rodeck big block. Then to Bac-Man heads. Then to a Littlefield blower. Then to a Arias with a A style PSI. then it was shelfed, back to a new style Mert blower. Then a B Blower to a Whipple, New Whipple and a REAL C blower. Yes in fact with Hynes we had a C blower. Then the D blower, better heads, stage 4, 5 and now the lastest 6 or whatever. All these things were done to stay competitive!! Just like changing to an A-Fuel car. So many have done it because it was felt that this was the way the class was going to be competitive.
     
    #1
    Wendland, Sep 2, 2003
  2. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    rob,

    thanks for posting, all opinions are valued here.

    however, i have to disagree on some points.

    if you take out bradshaw's numbers this year, you still have a 5.19 from reichert, 5.21 from tony, 5.23 from morgan, and numberous other .20's from those racers. lots and lots of low .30's. then you have marty's 5.32 in gville in some bad ass conditions. i think shields and wells ran some .34's in houston. so if you take out bradshaw's numbers, there is still over a tenth.

    regarding thacker's indy run, it is highly speculative to say it would have ran quicker than that .38. just as it can be said it would have been quicker had he not pedaled, he probably would have had to abort if he hadn't. keep in mind that wasn't a full off and on pedal, but a feather job by a great driver. two, it is highly unlikely that car would have stuck or ran near as good w/o the front wheels on the ground transferring the weight as hopped up as it was. had the front end been on the ground as some say it could have ran a low .30, it would have either blown the tires off or shook his ass off resulting in a mid .40. as i said before, that was the absolute perfect run in those conditions for a blown car, and the mid .30 passes ran in that session by the a/fuel cars were good, but not the perfect runs like marty's. we've seen bradshaw, reichert, bartone, bourke, gallant and others all go way quicker in those conditions.

    as far as buying parts to step up, i know many blown teams would have welcomed the chance at a c blower opposed to the current rules. comparing switching to a/fuel to buying new heads or blowers isn't quite the same. if you have a blown car and want to switch, about all you have that would be good on a a/fuel car is 1 mag (you have to buy another), heads (and they need work), headers, and front wheels. if they dont do something with the rules, you wont be able to give a blown car away because their will be so many for sale. so i think you are comparing apples to oranges on switching to a/fuel vs. buying new heads.

    rob, one point i brought up at the meeting was possibly a % limit at national event tracks, then no limit at divisionals. whats your thoughts on that?
     
    #2
    Will Hanna, Sep 2, 2003
  3. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    William,
    I don't buy it. Blown cars can run faster, it may cost more money, but thay can. I haven't ran a blown car in a couple of years but do keep in touch. You know we've seen more inprovement out of the funny cars with less blower than the dragsters with the same. Hell, Hynes' car went 259.60 six years ago with a tractor motor and a less effecient blower. Sheilds had some great numbers also along with Santos. If a blown car can run 263.00 mph, with the right combos should run in the low 30's. Ask Norm.

    Marty himself told Mike it could of been a better run.....Buy the way, you are pulling out indvidual runs when you say Reichert, Morgan, Bartone and so on. Conditions have to be right for them too. I can remenber when Santos had over a tenth on me everytime we met in 99'. I didn't think we should penalize him for going fast, I just needed to get my shit together to run that fast.

    I think you missed my point on the heads and blower deal. I just saying that over the years there are always things that a person must buy to keep up. Yes, an A-fuel car is more than a set of heads or a mag. In the long run though, it is cheeper to run. Ask Mike G., darien, they'll tell you.

    As far as the percentage deal, 2% kills them without making other changes. I would hate to change the tune up that much between div and national events, kind of like going to Denver.

    Will, if you want another ride, I may make you wait longer to piss then the time before....
    Now that's some funny shit!

    P.S There are 10 Blown cars qualified for Indy and 6 A-Fuel cars.........Boo Hoo....
     
    #3
    Wendland, Sep 2, 2003
  4. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    rob,

    some of the best and brightest minds in drag racing are tuning many blown cars out there and have yet to run in the .20s more than 4 times. meanwhile, the a/fuelers have ran in the teens 5 times, and more than i can count in the .20's, and probably hundreds of times in the .30's.

    there's a reason why you have not seen much improvement in et over the past 5 years for blown cars, because technology has been frozen in the critical areas of development. if you look at improvements in the past, they normally are associated with new parts coming out, new heads, tires, blowers, etc. it takes alot of hp to pick up a tenth or more. keep in mind the same car and tuner you keep referencing to -santos - was running this weekend.

    once again, in reference to marty's run being better, every run could have been better. however, there is a point where the run can not be better, and thats' the max the track will hold. marty was pretty close to that max, and having the wheels up was a big part of that.

    all i have to say about that last ride, was you are wrong, wrong wrong....
     
    #4
    Will Hanna, Sep 2, 2003
  5. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    oh, and btw, 10 of 19 blown cars qualified, and 6 of 10 a/fd's qualified. those 6 are all in the top 7 spots. hmmm.
     
    #5
    Will Hanna, Sep 2, 2003
  6. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Billy,

    Sounds pretty even to me.....Did you know that Norm had two full time guys that worked on Santos's car. They ate. slept and drank that race car. I have heard that Rods were 10 runs. Valves 14, and any one of the crew members on that team were capable of tuning that car. Maybe that's Davids problem now is that the cycle period doesn't match that of Norm's? I don't think I every saw Rick check out before the tree was activated also. That's how good of a team that was. 500,000 dollars doesn't hurt either.

    You know what Willy, I think they should bring out the E blower.... Brad and the crank guys would love it...Ask Franakin, 713-683-1023...He would like to see it happen. Knock out those main bearings for me please! I think from my point of view that would be the least cost to the A-Fuel guys...Just remember, you can't shove 10 pounds of shit in a 5 pound bag...You can, but it isn't pretty.....
     
    #6
    Wendland, Sep 2, 2003
  7. 310TAD

    310TAD Top Alcohol

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    Rob & Will,
    I told Mike our run could have been alittle better. IF, the front end would have stayed alittle lower,( which would have put it back on the ground sooner) without spinning the tires, I probably would not have had to quarter peddle it for a tength of a second. Althought the peddle is only discenable in the engine RPM and fuel flow and pressure graphs (can't even see it in the driveshaft RPM)it might have quickened the run to a .36 or .37. The only other possible help could have been the increased drag co-efficient of the dragster body not being at it's best disposition. Say another .01. Who knows? The point is if we could have made it 100% perfect it probably would have been a mid .30. If one of the AF/D's would have made a perfect run, based on historical facts from similar conditions, they could have run a teen.
    52.6% of the present BA/D's Qualified between #4 and #16.
    60 % of the present AF/D's qualified between #1 and #7.
    Anyway, thanks for all the compliments. The whole team did a great job on that run. I owe them alot.
    Look forward to seeing everyone again next weekend.
    Marty
     
    #7
    310TAD, Sep 2, 2003
  8. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Thanks Marty.

    Does anyone really know what the percentages should be? 50\50 60/40 70/30? At different tracks?
     
    #8
    Wendland, Sep 2, 2003
  9. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    bert,

    still, the best funded, smartest, team with one of the best drivers ever, only ran a 5.28. i think that points to a problem rather than 'yall need to work harder'

    i also think wells' team is alot better than people want to give credit. i also doubt the budget is that much less than obannon. the way some (not necessarily you bert) talk, if santos was still here he would be in the teens by now. thats bullshit. the same car and tuner is running, and hasnt even got close, and dave is a pretty damn good driver.

    see ya next week.

    btw are yall coming down to no problem too? looks to be slug fest down there. kelly, haley, callaway, howard, cannon, snow and others should make for an interesting race. black betty will be back out and she's pissed... :mad:

    marty, will you be there too?
     
    #9
    Will Hanna, Sep 2, 2003
  10. Michael Gunderson

    Michael Gunderson New Member

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    Rob, you should really tell everybody about the fifty dollars Will gave you to stir the pot or was that Alan?MG
     
    #10
    Michael Gunderson, Sep 2, 2003
  11. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Silly Willy,

    Ask Norm how many sleepless nights he had when he was in charge of the Santos deal. How many days they spent @ the dyno? Then ask how many days Bunny Boy spent there? They will not match. We would have the A-Fuel motor on that sucker if everyone wasn't so scared of what it would do. (Not being loaded right and all). Mark White, Myself, Mike G., Rydin Decal boys, Fred haygen, Lawson, and so on all spent a lot of time on the Dyno. When was the last time you were there? When was the last time you had someone really look at your heads, intake, pistons for improvement? I'm talking someone that knows what they are doing like Fred M. or a prostock guy. Even in Top fuel they are going though intake changes,cam, piston design changes and so on...

    Mike, Will said he would give me the 50 bucks to stir the pot. 100.00 if I wore out the bottom....
     
    #11
    Wendland, Sep 2, 2003
  12. Kingnitro

    Kingnitro New Member

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    Rob, you mentioned engine Dyno, where do you work? You drove the Blown In-and-out car in 2000 right? Your right about O'Bannon, he spent a lot of time and money to make that car go.
     
    #12
    Kingnitro, Sep 2, 2003
  13. alkysniffer

    alkysniffer New Member

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    Wow unbeleiveable how miss informed ppl are and think that they know it all.
     
    #13
    alkysniffer, Sep 2, 2003
  14. tjenna

    tjenna Top Alcohol

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    Great Thread
     
    #14
    tjenna, Sep 2, 2003
  15. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    King,
    I drove the late Mike Troxel's In-N-Out car in 99'. I was a Rookie of the year and ended up #6 in National Points. I own a performance\repair shop in Kansas. We do anything from street rods to blown boats to grandma's car. Brad Anderson and Fred Mandolini's are the dyno's that I'm talking about. Fred built a total of 3. I have tuned Four div. champions and have the fastest wing in Europe. That's about all I've got... Oh yeah, my other business builds custom motorcycles.

    Alkysniffer-----I really don't know where you are going with your thread but, I don't think I like it...Who are you? Another keyboard racer hiding behind a weak name...You should try to sniff some nitro, I would like to see you cry! If I'm wrong about your comment then I'm sorry....
     
    #15
    Wendland, Sep 3, 2003
  16. Kingnitro

    Kingnitro New Member

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    You mean they do something besides watch Jayhawk basketball in Lawrence?
     
    #16
    Kingnitro, Sep 3, 2003
  17. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    We do watch Jayhawk basketball, as far as the football team, I think were going to bring out the high school team to replace the college team. We lost to Northwestern.....That's sad....
     
    #17
    Wendland, Sep 3, 2003
  18. Rapid Transit

    Rapid Transit New Member

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    Mr. G You need to post more! I usually end up LMAO reading your post! The last one was perfect! See you this weekend!!! Tell Mrs I said hello. Kim :D
     
    #18
    Rapid Transit, Sep 3, 2003
  19. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    bert,

    some of us just have to use the track dyno. we made some changes over the off season and it ran 264 and change first race. guess it made more hp. we have tried different cams. we've tried six shooters. we've got the trickest wing, intake, etc. trust me, we are constantly looking for ways to make the car quicker and faster. you make it sound like most of us blown racers just show up crank it up and go run it.

    point is, i dont care if you spent a year on the dyno, a blown car isnt going to run 5.13 or .19 or .21 with the current technology.

    mike- dont let my secret out of the bag. now everytime someone stirs the pot, they'll be sending me a bill.... :eek:

    see yall next week
     
    #19
    Will Hanna, Sep 3, 2003
  20. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Billy Bong,

    You are right, I'm wrong. Your Pretty, I'm Ungly. Your smart, I'm dumb. What else can I say....


    But.......on the dyno you take the track out of the scenario, driver, different weather condtions and all that other crap. Will, keep up the good work, love the web site, tell Jason hope he is healing well. I'll be back to start some more shit...
     
    #20
    Wendland, Sep 3, 2003
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