INDY TARA-NHRA MEETING NOTES

Discussion in 'Pit Buzz' started by Will Hanna, Sep 23, 2003.

  1. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    Top ALcohol Racers Association Meeting Agenda- August 28, 2003

    NHRA Officials Present:
    Graham Light
    Jay Hullinger
    Len Imbrogno

    TARA Members Present:
    Tate Branch
    Mike Kosky
    Shelly Howard
    Marty Thacker
    Tom Conway

    Notes taken by Janet Kosky

    1. Introduction/Welcome - Tate Branch/President TARA

    2. Floor to NHRA-
    A. Discussion of NHRA's plans, thoughts, and issues for alcohol ranks

    3. Floor to TARA-
    A. Presentation of results from TARA member questionaire

    4. Floor to NHRA
    A. Open discussion of questionaire results

    5. Conclusion - Shelly Howard/Secretary TARA

    Meeting opened by Tate Branch. Question was asked of NHRA as to what plans and issues that concerned the alcohol classes.

    Graham Light asked why participation was down at most national events by the Funny Cars. He said that the participation by the dragsters was almost always good but the funny car turnout was lower. Reasons were given with regard to travel, economy, expense of running, and that it took more crew to run one. NHRA is concerned by the lack of participants in TAFC.

    Len Imbrogno stated that he has had emails regarding the funny cars and the fact that they don't want the blower overdrive back. That reason is why there has been some slowing down of the funny cars.

    The reason Graham Light gave for losing sessions, disregarding weather conditions was oil issues. Len Imbrogno stated that there has been improvement with the amount of oil downs within the alcohol classes. He stated that he had talked to some Division 6 racers regarding oil downs and solutions to this problem.

    Another topic that was brought up was the communications breakdown between NHRA and the racers to be called for qualifying or eliminations. Example was Gainesville when the racers heard the call over the announcing system.

    Graham Light spoke regarding the marketing of our sport and that we need to condense the race to a shorter time, with less time between rounds. Tom Conway stated that we have to deal with traffic issues and scale problems and still make the time factored into between round times. Another issue that TARA brought to NHRA was the fact that while going into the line for the scales, Pro Stock and Pro Stock Bike frequently bypassed the line and out in front of the alcohol cars. The statement was made that the wait was 45 minutes at one of the races. NHRA promised to look into that problem.

    Shelly Howard asked Graham what NHRA had plans as to the direction of the classes. Graham stated that NHRA had no immediate plans to change the existance of the alcohol classes - that they were the highlight of the divisional races and a big part of NHRA events. The subject of Pro Mod was discussed. Graham stated that the class was fully funded by a sponsor and if they lost the support of the sponsor, the class would not be at NHRA events. The statement was made that the alcohol Funny Car class felt threatened by Pro Mod and assurances were stated that they would not take over that class.

    The question was asked by TARA regarding equipment changes and expense control. NHRA stated that there were no changes in that regard to expect. Also, that they control such a small part of the overall expenses. They will continue to monitor any proposed changes that would be expensive. The statement was made by TARA that we are stagnant on new technology. NHRA stated that their goal is not to speed up the classes.

    Safety issues were discussed regarding some of the divisional tracks. Examples were lighting, guard rails, and safety equipment present at the tracks. Graham stated that the insurance companies dictate the requirements at each track. TARA stated the need to standardize those requirements. Graham stated that except for the fuel cars, alcohol dragsters and funny cars are faster than any other form of motor sports and a great show.

    Comments were also made by TARA that the announcing could be improved at some of the races. Exception was made regarding Brainerd. (The announcing at Indy was exceptional.) NHRA will continually try to improve. The problem is that sometimes they don't have a lot of information on some of the drivers. TARA will try to get this out to the racers so that they can fill out informational forms that can be used by the announcing staff.

    TARA reviewed the results of the questionaire with NHRA. Of the amount mailed, 36 funny car and 51 dragster forms were returned. It was very difficult to procure the names and addresses of licensed drivers and known owners. NHRA did not provide this information. TARA had to rely on its members and friends for this information.

    Promotion of the alcohol classes was discussed. Len Imbrogno stated that NHRA has a department dedicated to the promotion of the sportsman. Eric Lotz is director of field marketing, and Gary Darcy is Vice President of marketing. Len also said that NHRA sends media kits to all the divisional tracks for use in promoting these events. Some examples were cited how some other attractions were tied into get more people interested in than just the hard core drag racers. The goal is to put people into the stands. Graham stated that they have to rely upon the pros at the national events to accomplis this. Copies of the media guides Len mentioned were given to TARA.

    TARA asked what plans NHRA has for 2004 with regard to the parity question.

    Graham stated that he and the committee (Len Imbrogno, Cary Menard, Bob DeVour, Steve Gibbs, and Ray Alley) would be meeting with regard to these issues prior to the race at Reading. He also stated that TARA was a definite benefit to the organization as a representative body.

    Meeting was adjourned.

    On Sunday, Aug. 31, 2003, TARA attempted to hold a meeting in the driving rain. Some interested parties could not be properly contacted and we had to rely upon the word of mouth. At this meeting the above meeting minutes were discussed and further discussion was presented as to the reported details. An announcement was made that TARA had gotten assurance from NHRA regarding waivers. There are now 8 available to the alcohol classes. That was a direct benefit that will be immediate. Len Imbrogno was invited to speak and answer any of the questions directed to him. A review of the discussion that had taken place at the meeting August 28, 2003 was presented and further discussed. All of which were questions that appeared on the questionnaire. All agreed that these things were needed for the betterment and advancement of the alcohol classes.
     
    #1
    Will Hanna, Sep 23, 2003
  2. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    Sept. 23, 2003

    TARA is posting these minutes for viewing by interested parties as a goodwill gesture. Our organization is only as good as its membership and the suggestions and ideas that are put forth by the membership are necessary to accomplish the things that are needed for the improvement of the Top Alcohol Classes.

    All future information regarding TARA issues will be available on the TARA website ( TARA Website ) Your involvement - A/Fuel, Blown Alcohol and Funny Car is not only requested, but needed for the organization and classes to move forward as a whole.
     
    #2
    Will Hanna, Sep 23, 2003
  3. Wendland

    Wendland Guest

    Great post Will....thanks for keeping all of us informed.....What are TARA's next moves?
     
    #3
    Wendland, Sep 23, 2003
  4. Langenhammer

    Langenhammer New Member

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    Did I read that correctly? We now get 8 starting line waivers!!! That's great, much needed at times. Kudo's ladies and gents of TARA.
     
    #4
    Langenhammer, Sep 23, 2003
  5. Ghost - Kevin

    Ghost - Kevin Member

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    "Graham Light asked why participation was down at most national events by the Funny Cars. He said that the participation by the dragsters was almost always good but the funny car turnout was lower. Reasons were given with regard to travel, economy, expense of running, and that it took more crew to run one. NHRA is concerned by the lack of participants in TAFC.

    Len Imbrogno stated that he has had emails regarding the funny cars and the fact that they don't want the blower overdrive back. That reason is why there has been some slowing down of the funny cars."

    -------------------------------------------------
    Someone please tell me that Tate didn't choke on his doughnut at this point. And....did they say this with a straight face????....and no reply from the TARA side to these statements..????...

    Like..."well Graham, 4 of the most attended races by the TAFC's were removed from the schedule".....Denver, Pheonix, 2nd Vegas, 1st chicago....your largest grouping of TAFC racers, those in div 7, got hurt bad by this decison with regards to Pheonix, Denver, and Las Vegas....all you have to do is look at the Las Vegas Divisional directly after the 2nd LVMS national event....I believe there were 17 cars there last year, for a divisional race???...

    and then about the 125 reduction and those emails they have gotten supporting that....at this point did someone atleast spit their coffee up???

    Just wondering....

    Kevin Hool
     
    #5
    Ghost - Kevin, Sep 23, 2003
  6. Kingnitro

    Kingnitro New Member

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    I'm curious which TAFC racers didn't want the 125 OD back? I haven't met one!
     
    #6
    Kingnitro, Sep 23, 2003
  7. Gerry Woz

    Gerry Woz Comp Eliminator

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    Kevin.....kudos for speaking your mind..I don't know of anyone who "WAS" or "IS" for the blower overdrive reduction.. .and who would be emailing NHRA and congratulating them on such a stupid decision? Talk about increasing the cost of the sport :mad:
    ...I've worn out my keyboard pleading with Len to give us a lockup clutch ..but to no avail...a "simple" air activated 2 stage lockup modification to your existing clutch/can is "Cheap" and would greatly reduce damage associated with the excessive slippage and relating heat that we now experience. If you are'nt pulling the clutch every run and changing floaters and discs..you are wasting your time.. We used to be able to run a lockup years ago and I'm telling you from experience they work and reduce clutch maintenance. It also greatly reduces your tendancy for tire shake ... because you can fine tune clutch engagement as it's not directly related to RPM.... [​IMG]
    TARA:..Would you mind investigating the interest of active TAFC racers for the "re-instatement" a 2-stage lockup?... :D
     
    #7
    Gerry Woz, Sep 23, 2003
  8. Kingnitro

    Kingnitro New Member

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    Gerry, word is that Bob Devour pushed for the OD change more than anyone. Since he's on the Competition committee, I guess you guys can thank him personally!
     
    #8
    Kingnitro, Sep 24, 2003
  9. ROF

    ROF Top Dragster

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    Kevin, I have to disagree with you concerning Denver. True the last year that Denver ran Alcohol the FC feild was full but in years past both TAD and TAFC had weak feilds. Having said that, they replace Denver with Brainard, DAAH, which always had very small feilds (until this year,but,TAD was still weak). Besides, we went to the Denver National this year and they could not fit another Golf Car in their pit area, much less 40 TAD/TAFC cars. The other races you listed, I have to agree with you.

    The notes didn't reflect much in response from Tara regarding TAFC. What did TARA accomplish in regards to TAFC?

    If ALL of the TAFC guys want the OD back you need to flood Len with e-mail the next few weeks asking him for the OD back. If you have a TAFC buddy give him Lens e-mail address. Will it work? Probably not because I think most of the TAFC are now happy with the new OD rule and have changed their combinations. I could be wrong.

    [ September 24, 2003, 08:14 PM: Message edited by: F-O-R ]
     
    #9
    ROF, Sep 24, 2003
  10. The Zone

    The Zone Member

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    Woz, isn't the new clutch from AFT/Davenport supposed to help a bunch. Some guys are using it already.
    Dean
     
    #10
    The Zone, Sep 24, 2003
  11. Gerry Woz

    Gerry Woz Comp Eliminator

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    Dean;

    Yes the modification you are refering to does perform a similar function but still falls short..and it still relies totally on RPM...supposed to anyway...with the 2-stage lockup that I'm lobbying for..you are in precise control as to when an additional 2 - 3 fingers ( out of 6); are engaged(usually an air delay off the pedal)...and by varying the weight on the fingers ( primary and secondary) as well as the time of that secondary engagement...well this is just infinitely more accurate and adjustable to variable track conditions, horsepower etc. [​IMG]
     
    #11
    Gerry Woz, Sep 24, 2003
  12. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

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    Since the cat has been out of the bag on the blower overdrive for such a long time, I don't know how many would support changing it back. Most have blowers with tighter tolerances now that won't allow faster speeds without killing them. Back when the rule was proposed and implemented there weren't ANY that favored it that we could find. Only the liason as mentioned in an earlier post felt it would be better and he convinced Len I. and NHRA that it would be a popular decision and a parts saver. It never was either one of these.

    I mentioned to Tate Branch a while back that fewer and fewer TA/FC's are able to reach the 2250# minimum weight (unless Tate or Brett Williamson are driving them). NHRA looks like they are going to mandate full firewalls in the funnycar bodies next year, too. I suggested that they have a look at the log book at the scales produced at National Events to see who is at minimum weight compared to those who exceed it by more than 25 pounds. Considering the results, they should seriously look at raising it 25 pounds or so.

    I removed everything but the kitchen sink off Dennis Taylor's car last winter and it dropped about 80 pounds from it's original fighting weight of 2380#. There is nothing left to remove or lighten and no parts are available to make it any lighter except for a titanium tree. It still comes in at plus or minus 2300#. Jay is in the same boat. Now I know these guys are larger in stature, but they have the means to race and shouldn't be penlyzed or forced to hire a lighter driver. As a sportsman class, there should be a bigger margin allowing just about everyone the chance to drive without being penalized or having to skip meals, IMHO.

    By the way, 8 restricted area passes are a good deal. Thank you.
     
    #12
    Randy G., Sep 24, 2003
  13. imjustafan

    imjustafan New Member

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    Living in the Phoenix area I was VERY VERY disapointed to have the Phoenix and Las Vegas Nationals pulled from the schedule. Are there any chances of them being reinstated? Its just not the same without the Alky classes in attendance.
     
    #13
    imjustafan, Sep 25, 2003
  14. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

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    Call NHRA and ask them. We always had a lot of fun running there.
     
    #14
    Randy G., Sep 25, 2003
  15. Mr Scary

    Mr Scary New Member

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    Tell me about it! I can't even see Alky cars at my Hometown track! At least the Natls!
     
    #15
    Mr Scary, Sep 25, 2003
  16. ROF

    ROF Top Dragster

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    "NHRA is concerned by the lack of participants in TAFC"

    Prentered

    Chicago 30

    Dallas 25

    Pomona 8

    Things were looking good until Pomona. What's up? This is FC country...
     
    #16
    ROF, Sep 26, 2003
  17. Mr Scary

    Mr Scary New Member

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    F-O-R, Pomona now has 15 TAFC's pre-entered! They're kicking ass now! :D
     
    #17
    Mr Scary, Oct 2, 2003
  18. The Zone

    The Zone Member

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    The small turnout is only because, they don't want to many cars there. There are pretty tough requirements for entry to that race. But if they get down to the time where there is very few entries then they open it up more. That is why you see guys like John Knox and Forrest LeBlanc on the list now. Last year was a fiasco, with less than a full field in TAFC.
    Dean
     
    #18
    The Zone, Oct 3, 2003

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