Arias vs MBR

Discussion in 'Manton Push Rods Top Alcohol Tech Questions' started by SoDak, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. NITROBANDIT1

    NITROBANDIT1 LOST IN SPACE

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Messages:
    649
    Likes Received:
    2
    Pink slip

    no, rick paradise was recently let go. I take it new management wanted to move in another direction...whatever that means? they scrapped the 8.3 program altogether after spending tons of money tooling up and getting parts made. wth? im not sure but cn doesn't seem to be so sure about making blocks anymore. I contacted them, they said talk to miner. apparently because aj is making the new ones now, they aren't interested in making them anymore. cn has no parts for any of the blocks made either. I also agree with jody, mbr have won a lot of races, including a tad world championship just a year or so ago. give one to manzo and see how long it takes !!!!! I am not spending the money to put a aj chevy head on my block, that's ridiculous.
     
    #21
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2013
  2. jody stroud

    jody stroud ZOMBIE Top Dragster

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    10
    I'd like to see Grimes get ahold of a MBR motor and a racer with deep enough pockets to really be able to lean on one hard.
     
    #22
  3. TOL

    TOL Active Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2005
    Messages:
    1,112
    Likes Received:
    5


    Bummer...... I hope Rick lands on his feet. When I last talked to him I got the impression the company was fully tooled and ready to go ahead with the new program, and that he was making a bunch of new/different "special" hard anodized main caps for the new block program that he would supply to CN. Do you happen to have any info on that whole deal, or new contact points for Rick himself these days?.........
     
    #23
  4. NITROBANDIT1

    NITROBANDIT1 LOST IN SPACE

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Messages:
    649
    Likes Received:
    2
    find rickdo

    im checking , let u know if I find out any info RHINOS RULE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
    #24
  5. overkill69

    overkill69 Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2005
    Messages:
    826
    Likes Received:
    0
    mbr

    I looked at the engine before switching to BAE. Miner was impressive but he told me all the cast stuff was useless and I knew the rig was at least 50lbs heavier.
    I've heard they are very stout on the dyno but for some reason they struggle in door cars.
    one thing I noticed on the BAE is they try to keep everything interchangeable where the Fontana/Arias/MBR deal has numerous variations of stuff that kinda fits together...like a Chevy vs Ford.lol.
    The BAE has plenty of issues but it will never be replaced by an engine thats bigger/heavier and makes similiar power.
     
    #25
  6. Cpt Kludge

    Cpt Kludge Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2009
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    2
    Some of the interchange confusion may be from the original Arias 8.3. Back in the day there were two head variations for the 8.3, a fathead and a narrow head. The fathead used a valley cover and runner manifold design and does not interchange with the narrow head stuff. You see some of this stuff for sale today and is identifiable by the very wide and low height of the valve covers. The narrow head is what has been produced in larger volumes and the only head produced by Fontana and MBR. The only interchange issues I am aware of from MBR to Arias are the roller rocker assemblies currently produced by MBR. They won't work with my old Arias cast heads. You also can get into various manifold differences for the different block deck heights but that would be the same with any other manufacturer. I picked up a MBR cast mag front cover/gear drive that fits fine on my old cast Arias block.

    I've been around this engine since the early 90's and have been sold on it since, based on it's unique design features. Like others have said here, the difference between manufacturers is in the combination and tuning in the all out classes. I seem to remember a guy named Keith Stark running an A/Fueler with a Fontana engine that was tough to beat!

    MBR has become the go to deal in the pulling classes. Friends that have been running the Arias/Fontana/MBR stuff since the 80's have told me they're making more power than ever and maintenance is at an all time low. They are winning pulls and having more fun!

    Sorry to hear about Rick. He has been a big help getting our old junk into some kind of shape and ready to race. I hope where ever he lands he can still help us.
     
    #26
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  7. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    1,879
    Likes Received:
    28
    About 10 minutes ago Joey Severance just ran a 5.28 to qualify number one over Whitely's 5.29 in Las Vegas with one of those engines that are "not even close to being competitive" per jim@victory. Not a geat way to drum up chassis business by trashing someone else's stuff on message boards if you ask me.
     
    #27
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  8. kosky racing

    kosky racing Comp Eliminator

    Joined:
    May 11, 2003
    Messages:
    601
    Likes Received:
    20
    Joeys run

    That run was made with a Jim Whitely Norm Grimes engine___________!
     
    #28
  9. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    1,879
    Likes Received:
    28
    Hmmmm.


    .
     
    #29
  10. jim@victoryracecars

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    0
    I did say that I hope it gets turned around and the class needs the engines. NOTHING was said about any chassis.
     
    #30
  11. Dave Germain

    Dave Germain New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2003
    Messages:
    896
    Likes Received:
    0
    Chassis

    I have thought it is interesting that everybody here is so focused on engines and nobody is talking chassis. Apparently for some reason Joey has a Norm Grimes/Jim Whitely motor in his car this weekend. Also from what I can see Roger Bateman is out there with them. I believe the truth is that it is a combination of motor, tuner, and chassis that determines how well a car runs. We have all seen guys who run like rockets then change chassis and can't run for crap and the opposite also. I have always been curious how a MBR motor would run in a Victory chassis. Right now it seems like the Victory chassis is the hot ticket. Dave Germain
     
    #31
  12. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    1,879
    Likes Received:
    28
    Obviously you missed the point I was making.
     
    #32
  13. jim@victoryracecars

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just as obviously, you missed mine.
     
    #33
  14. jim@victoryracecars

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    0
    True words, Dave. Thanks for your kind comments, I did not mean to offend anyone. I guess I did, for that I apologize.
     
    #34
  15. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Messages:
    1,879
    Likes Received:
    28
    Is that why you deleted your entire post on page 2 of this thread that I was referring to? Just in case anyone missed it, here it is...

    "I've heard many TA/FC racers brag about serviceability, etc. How they would quit if they had to "go back" to a late model. Problem is, that motor is not even close to being competitive. Late models win...MBRs don't. "

    What you are referring to are statements made here a while back by Clint Thompson regarding his experience with the Miner engine and Bob Miner in particular because he helps his customers with their combinations.

    My point is, you represent a chassis builder. You hope people will use your services. But you come on here and trash an engine manufacturer that well respected TA/FC racers like Steve Gasparelli, Doug Gordon, Clint Thompson, etc., chose to use and have done very well with. I guess you missed the Gordon's 5.500 they ran at Pomona a few years ago with that combination when low 5.50's were considered rare. Now you are deleting your posts and backpeddalling when I challenge you.

    If I was looking to build a new car, even though I've been a BAE customer for 23+ years, I wouldn't order a clevis pin from you because of the way you desparage the Miner's stuff on an internet message board. Just out of curiousities sake, how would you respond if Greg Miner got on here and started trashing your chassis? You might say "How does he know about our cars...he's never owned one." And that's another good point to make. Which engines have you run, and what was your experience when you tried the Miner's stuff? I'll stay near the computer waiting for your answer.

    Now if that isn't getting your point, I don't know what is. And now you know my point.

    Have a nice day.
     
    #35
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
  16. jim@victoryracecars

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2012
    Messages:
    58
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have apologized to those that I may have offended.
    I am not referring to any comments made by Mr. Thompson.
    You challenged me?
    Oops...your "clevis order" seems to have been lost.
     
    #36
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2013
  17. aj481x

    aj481x Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2004
    Messages:
    915
    Likes Received:
    8
    Kids, play nice. ;)
     
    #37
  18. SoDak

    SoDak Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2006
    Messages:
    1,512
    Likes Received:
    3
    I was expecting to hear that the MBR heads are a ton better
     
    #38
  19. Dave Germain

    Dave Germain New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2003
    Messages:
    896
    Likes Received:
    0
    Heads?

    I don't know that any one mfg head is totally better than the other. The late model BAE stuff, the Alan Johnson heads, the MBR heads and the Veney heads have all won events. I think the BAE stuff has won more but then again they are the majority of the motors out there. When I ruined my last Walt motor I called around and the best deal with the soonest delivery date was MBR. I didn't know anything about them at the time but I wanted to go racing and not wait. So there are a lot of factors in making a decision of what to buy. Good luck with your choices- Dave Germain
     
    #39
  20. NITROBANDIT1

    NITROBANDIT1 LOST IN SPACE

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Messages:
    649
    Likes Received:
    2
    Mbrs rule the earth

    just to answer overkills comment, I believe the only 2 designs miner is working on is the 10.2 deck for dragsters and 10.7 for funny cars, the only difference being the deck height. the intake is different, but I have some 10.2 manifolds with small spacers to make them fit 10.7 no problem. in the past some of the tractor pull guys used a 11.2 deck, but that's old school Fontana stuff. the new blocks come with bigger cam bearing diameter for a stiffer cam with 4/7 swap also. in addition the the new roller rockers ( im partial to the old steel ones myself) he is also making bigger port heads now too. as with brad these engines are always in a state of update and improvement. some good, some hardly worth the expense, some just for cosmetics sake, and some just to sell more parts with a bitchin new part number (brad 3,4 5,6,7,8,8x,8y,8z). does this mean the new ones are better? are the cars going faster that 10 years ago? im positive that if nhra didn't kill some of these engines,(Fontana,herbert 4 cam, bb chevy, batten, santo 3 valve, etc) for top fuel, many would have surpassed the old school engines in tech and we wouldn't be stuck buying from one source. kinda like screw blowers? luckily there are guys like miner with faith in their product to keep building them. btw jim, wheres my 2 clevis pins? ive been waiting for weeks! after I had my heads max out a superflow 600, I was told the engines probably couldn't use any more airflow anyway ! now I see the sonny semi hemis have got some 200 cfm over mine, I would like to see a tafc engine with these heads on it. that would be interesting.
     
    #40

Share This Page