1000' for alky in Pomona?

Discussion in 'System One Pit Buzz' started by Will Hanna, Jul 29, 2008.

  1. Barry H

    Barry H Member

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    Russ, I'm glad to see you back out there! Jan & I are going to try & get to Bakersfield & the Finals to visit. Hope to see you then.
     
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  2. Will Hanna

    Will Hanna We put the 'inside' in Top Alcohol
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    good points

    Russ,

    Good points and parachutes need to have a lot of attention to improve their deployment rate. What I'm getting at is Pomona is a track that there is little or no room for error in the chute dept. An extra 320 would go a long way towards minimizing the risk there. The other side of the coin until they come up with some better containment systems, maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea for this year? Its sand, nets, then wall there. Merts deal did have a lot to do with the condition of the sand, it was pretty muddy. When you hit that sand at a very high rate of speed, it's anyone's guess whether it's going to dig in and flip end-do style, plow, or as it was in scott kalitta's case, go airborne and skip a lot of the sand.

    i don't know if it has anything to do with those of us on this side of the pecos are more accostomed to different track lengths. it seems 1/8 mile racing is a lot more common out here than the west coast. it seems like if you say anything other than 1/4 mile some people react like you called their mother don hudson or something....

    mert, wasn't singling you out on that deal. it was just real scary there for a minute from my vantage point until we found out in the tower that was just the body, not the car.

    back to watching mesquite championship rodeo reruns....:rolleyes:
     
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  3. Don Hudson

    Don Hudson Supa fly

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  4. Randy G.

    Randy G. Top Alcohol

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    Like I said. in 2004 Marc White went 254 in my car at Pomona with no chutes and he slid it to a stop short of the sand. I have Lamb carbon rears and Strange carbon fronts. If they were the old SPE steel brakes like the one's I had on my Plueger car he would have been tee'd up on number 9 at Mountain Meadows (golf course past the road at Pomona) by the time he got it stopped.

    I watched Shelly Anderson run 298 in her top fuel car years ago at Pomona, no chutes and she made the turn. Lamb carbon rears.

    If you drive like you really want to stop and get after the brakes immediately instead of waiting for the tug of the chutes (or lack of it) you have a chance. I got on Pete Swayne several times because he would clear the lights, count top three, hit the chutes and never get after the brakes. He just assumed the chutes would always work. Thankfully for him they did.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 31, 2008
  5. Russ Parker

    Russ Parker Member

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    Barry,
    Thanks, it's always great to see you and Jan. We will be at Bakersfield and the Finals so I'll look forward to seeing you there.
    Don Hudson,
    Thanks for being such a great sport. Is that why they put you in the special pit section at the Seattle divisional last year? I promise that was my last shot...unless I can think of another...hmmmmm.
    Will,
    You are certainly right that the 1000' would give you a greater margin for error. While it would remain my preference to run 1/4 mile, if a majority of the alcohol racers decided on 1000' for Pomona I would fall in line and do what I could to get it in place. Is it time for an official poll? Could that be something done through our divisional representitives?
     
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    Last edited: Jul 31, 2008
  6. SICTOR

    SICTOR hola amigos!

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    yo?

    Larry, what do you think?
     
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  7. Dave Germain

    Dave Germain New Member

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    I completely agree with Russ when he says the best way to clean up an accident it to prevent it to begin with- good call. Dave Germain
     
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  8. mark6052

    mark6052 Member

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    1000ft

    early on somebody posted that if you dont think the track is safe "stay home". well if you cant race 1000ft "stay home";) the 1/4 mile was "invented in the 50s, what? we cant make a change? maybe we should do away with bracket racing, its run what yabrung, its not the way it was first started. heads up only:rolleyes: you race with rule changes based on parity, but f- anything that might make you safer!
     
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    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 31, 2008
  9. ch3no2

    ch3no2 New Member

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    1000 foot SUCKS!!!!!

    As a fan of drag racing I will never accept 3.88's as a real time. To me it just sucks. Most fans, (those who only watch it and don't participate) don't care about all of this, they just want to see 1/4 mile racing like it's always been. The fans are why people are able to race, they pay the bills. Although it may be safer and cheaper to race 1000 ft. it is not as appealing to the fans. Hell, I bet it would be cheaper and safer to run to the 60 foot line, lets do that.
     
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  10. mark6052

    mark6052 Member

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    fans

    fans didnt like restrictor plate racin either, didnt hurt nascar. most fans dont understand comp racing, fans are puzzled by throttle stop racing. do you fans understand all the restrictions that are in place for fuel to run? or alcohol.
     
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  11. Russ Parker

    Russ Parker Member

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    For years I have felt that one of the strengths of drag racing was the opportunity for racers and fans to connect. When racers start berating fans or their lack of knowledge of the sport, or for sharing their opinions, they are cutting their own throat. To be successful in business you must find a demand and fill it effectively. Drag racing should be no different - needs to be a good show, done safely and for the fans be affordable.
     
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  12. mbaker3

    mbaker3 New Member

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    I couldn't have said it better, thanks, Russ!

    I dare say that there is not a single one of us here that didn't start out in drag racing as a fan. Not a single one of us "understood" what made an alcohol motor tick. Not a single one of us knew about the volumetric and adiabatic efficiencies of a blower. We asked questions, we learned by doing, we continued to "stumble along" until we got better.
    Some here are already at or near the top, some, like me, just got started and looking to learn something everyday.

    Please, please don't "slam" a fan of the sport because you "might" know a little more about it then they do. That is when that "fan" comes back in a few years as a racer and "stomps" your a$$ at the track.
    I "am, and always will be a fan" no matter whether I am racing or not!
     
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  13. mark6052

    mark6052 Member

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    you are right. racing needs tobe a good show, done safely and affordable for fan and racer. that said, sounds like some of the reasons for 1000ft racing. if kallita had been running a 1000ft race and survived, would that have been abad thing? we know that answer. racing HAS changed from the 50s. except for the 1/4 mile part, nothing much is traditionally the same. my point is this, if 1000ft racing can save lives; for tradition sake we should stay at 1/4? Im a safety inspector, some of you sound like employers that feel certain jobs are just inherently dangerous, and its just the way it is getting hurt. safety costs to much or it will cause more dangers,... most safety rules are wrote in someones blood. I pray the next rule made is not because of yours. :cool:
     
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  14. MaineAlkyFan

    MaineAlkyFan Member

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    Fan Ramblings

    As a lifelong fan (attended my first drags in '68 at the age of 10) I'd consider myself fairly knowledgable. That said, I fully understand Dave's comments about my opinion not mattering relative to this issue, and take no offense. I enjoyed congratulating Dave's team in broken French after their first national win, and always am in the stands for pretty much every class of racing except Super Comp. I also understand that fans really don't pay the bills of the sportsman racers, most of the fans are just interested in the pros. Indirectly, however, we do help provide for venues you guys race on.

    Some of us fans are more concerned about safety than others... personally I'm usually upset about how the "safety is first priority" NHRA is always cutting corners to save a dime, cater to the pro classes, and bow before the TV dollar gods. My previous rants on this board about Mark Albert's 2006 crash in Reading and the subsequent non-discussion of it by NHRA come to mind. Suffice to say NHRA is more concerned about the bottom line than exercising any common sense unless or until a named pro gets killed or badly injured. NHRA is like the schoolyard bully that "asks" you for your sandwich to cross the playground, then acts high and mightly for letting you cross without harm.

    One thing for sure, even the most casual fan knows more about drag racing than Paul Page... :p
     
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  15. mbaker3

    mbaker3 New Member

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    Are you actually telling me that they "are not" turbocharged:D:D
     
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  16. BOBBY MARTINDALE

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    1000' vs 1320'

    Will need did you get a clear count?Thanks for an outstanding web site.;)
     
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  17. nitrohawk

    nitrohawk New Member

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    MainAlkieFan:
    Like what you said about NHRA bowing to the TV Gods but what would you think if I told you that NHRA "pays" ESPN to televise the races.
     
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  18. MaineAlkyFan

    MaineAlkyFan Member

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    I'd think it just proves my point that they will cut safety corners to make the Pro Show go as smoothly as possible. Especially since if they are paying to play with ESPN, they want to make sure they are getting the best bang for the buck.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm all for making a dollar and keeping a profitable business model going, but when people get hurt and (1) it was preventable and told to the powers that be before the event, and (2) is covered up, minimized, and swept under the rug to protect the "safety image" of the NHRA, it pisses this fan off.

    Someday, they will just go too far and get bit by their own tactics. The whole nitro soap opera with Shoemaker is an example. If I can catch up to him at Reading, I'll tell him that if he pulled his entire operation over to IHRA in protest, I'd be more than happy to support him by traveling to New England Dragway (8 hours closer to me) for the races instead of Reading. Of course, NHRA knows the team sponsors will not allow protests like this, so they get to play the bully.

    Tha sad part is everybody except NHRA sees the charade, while they pretend to be unaware and high and mighty. Whatever. I can sleep at night with a clear conscience.

    And a big THANK YOU to all you racers, who knowing the liability, risk, and expense of racing under these circumstances, still come out and put on a show for us spectators. One of the things I love about Reading is the stands don't empty for the sportsman classes... you guys are really appreciated in Div. 1.
     
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  19. Hemi Parts

    Hemi Parts Top Fuel

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    About this 1000 foot thing

    Man, the racing is tighter and far less carnage so far. That's a very good thing.

    As I mentioned in an earlier post. I suggested this change to NHRA and on the message boards almost four (4) years ago. I'm still stinging from the beating I took for even thinking about changing the sacred 1/4 mile thing.

    I would like to make one thing perfectly clear since Will so graciously allows us the space to do so. I for one don't like clicking it off at 1000 feet. I'm pretty sure if things were now as they were in the "good old days". When tires lasted a whole lap, most of the other racers wouldn't want to click it off at 1000 feet either. Tracks used to have an appropriate amount of shut down. Today some don't. However even on the tracks with enough shut down we have progressed as a sport to a level that there is not presently a tire that will handle the speeds we can attain if the sanctioning body allows us "life without limits".

    Top Fuel and Funny car began as a run what you brung class. They were actually referred to as "unlimited classes" in the beginning. They now are the most highly regulated classes there are. Without these regulations there is no telling how fast and quick they would be capable of running. The racers would be able to build race cars that would far exceed anything the tire manufactures could build. In short, it is my opinion (I might be wrong) that we have exceeded what can reasonably be expected from a rubber tire.

    Back to the 1000 foot thing. If that is what it takes to be able to run these things flat out and last better, it's a good thing and I'm for it. Again it's not near as much fun ending the run "early" but that's way better than the sport going away. If you don't think it can go away, then I guess you wern't around for the nitro ban of the 60s.

    I suggest that if the cars ran without scoreboards and they backed the finish line up about 50 or so feet at a time over the coarse of 5-6 years no one would even notice the difference.

    Now what they missing is the opportunity to cash in on the positive side of this deal. They should make a commitment and establish 1000 foot ET and MPH records and let the record setting begin which would affect points as well add back the element that the fans really used to have an interest in. That was seeing a "record run" as well as the drama it adds to a tight points chace. The only reason NHRA eliminated points being awarded for a MPH record is they wanted to discourage running the cars out the back door which at 1000 feet is not as much of an issue. Besides they also took the step of moving the second MPH clock to the finish line as opposed to 66' beyond the finish line. Therefore the displayed speed now is not truly indicative of the actually speed at the finish line but rather an average speed the car runs between 66' before the finish line to the finish line.

    So there you have it. Let the records show I don't like racing less than 1320 feet but given the circumstances we race under today, it is probably the best solution. Now if you want my opinion about how to slow the cars down without all this rev limiter, nitro percentage, take everything away foolishness, I think.......uh never mind. What do I know..........

    Thanks for the space, Will.

    BA
     
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  20. Russ Parker

    Russ Parker Member

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    I agree with the 1000' for T/F and F/C, as well as looking at options for slowing them down. But this thread was started with the specific question of whether alcohol cars should race 1000' at Pomona. Should we approach our divisional reps requesting that NHRA run us 1000' at Pomona?
     
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