24v start wiring help

Discussion in 'Manton Push Rods Top Alcohol Tech Questions' started by caseyspradlin, Jan 23, 2011.

  1. caseyspradlin

    caseyspradlin Member

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    hey wanted to do the 24v start deal on my dragster...I've searched some old posts but can anyone get me a description about how to do it the CSR (without charging me $600) way so that I don't have to buy a 24V battery charger or disconnect the batteries to charge them?

    Thanks
     
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  2. TADHemiracer

    TADHemiracer Member

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    24V Start Wiring

    I had to convert my starting system to 24 volts because the 12 volt starter would not turn my new motor over fast enough (cranking speed) for the MSD 44 to fire. I used two $38 four pole solenoids (each solenoid has 2 NO contacts, 2 NC contacts, like a winch motor uses) and now my motor turns fast enough to fire AND I can charge both batteries with a single 12 volt charger. I have $76 invested in my 24V starter system, other than the starter itself. Another benefit is, that I now only have two motorcycle batteries onboard at 12 pounds each instead of 2 38 pound batteries. 24 volts make a huge difference in cranking speed AND amp draw required. A 16V battery did not spin it fast enough to fire the magneto. We use a quick disconnect battery booster when cranking in the pits to save the motorcycle batteries for the starting line. NOTE: I did burn up my first starter because it would not take the 24 volts. I found that the Tilton "Severe Duty" handles the voltage fine with zero problems. Worked for me on my 526 KB hemi, 14-71, 42% over hi-helix. Spins it fast and fires fast (builds oil pressure quick too prior to firing it ). Been using this set up for three years. Send me your email address and I will send you a schematic showing the wiring required. Good luck.
     
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  3. blown375

    blown375 New Member

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    If you just clamp the charger on to each battery individually you don't have to disconnect them.
     
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  4. TADHemiracer

    TADHemiracer Member

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    24 Volt Start

    As long as you can easily get to both batteries, clamping on to each battery individually works fine, but if you are trying to use a single charging post in the pits to charge both batteries at the same time, not so much. I use my set up with a single 12V battery charger in the pits and can charge both batteries at the same time. I can also use a standard battery maintainer at the shop to keep both batteries charged in the off season. Just another .02 worth. Keep the change if it isn't worth what it cost.
     
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  5. hotrodharlkey

    hotrodharlkey New Member

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    would you mind sending one also?can i get 12 volts off it for ectric shift and a few other 12 volts i'll be using on blown door slammer?
    don
    hotrodharley@citlink.net
     
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  6. jody stroud

    jody stroud ZOMBIE Top Dragster

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    Casey with a MSD 10 16 volts is all you will ever need, try a rock racing 16 volt....Ronnie Davis is a dealer.
     
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  7. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster

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    No doubt that all you need is a 16 volt battery but you also need $200 to buy the battery and another $200 to but a 16 v battery charger. At least with a 24 v system the batteries are reasonable and you already have a charger.

    If you need a very reliable 24 v solenoid for the starter then go to a CAT dealer. They sell one that looks just like the older Ford starter solenoids for right around $30. We never had it fail.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 24, 2011
  8. Shoebox

    Shoebox New Member

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    24V Start Wiring

    Hi TADHemiracer

    What kind of battery ( motorcycle) did you use ( dyna batt or similar? )

    Thanks in advance
    Shoebox
     
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  9. caseyspradlin

    caseyspradlin Member

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    batteries

    jody unfortunently(sp?) my car was made to hold two of the odyssey 12V in the nose, so the 16V would be a hassle.

    Mike, what's the part number of that solenoid?

    Alky...funny story, glad your ok and most importantly your shop. I have tried the varying my gap also, but thanks.

    Checking magnet strength today. Will compare to my MSD wheel on other motor.
     
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  10. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster

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    Casey, I don't remember the part number for that CAT solenoid but if you talk to the CAT parts counter guy he can probably have it.
     
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  11. caseyspradlin

    caseyspradlin Member

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    24V solenoid

    Mike, not sure if hemi is up this morning so I haven't gotten diagram he made yet, but do you think the solenoids he is using are 24V? If not are you able to charge both batteries with one charger with your setup? How did yo make it work, if you don't mind?

    thanks
     
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  12. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster

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    We ended up buying a 24 v charger but our batteries are really hidden away in the trunk and are hard to get to. I bought a high amperage switch used on boats to switch battery combinations and it caught on fire and melted and nearly burned up the car. You need to check out that wiring diagram. There maybe a better way out there.
     
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  13. aj481x

    aj481x Member

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    I would like to comment on the 12v/24v starting deal. 24v is the way to start a blown motor with 14.71 and 44 mag. The way to do it is to mount a heavy duty 12v solenoid as close to the batterys as possible, the robotics type or heavy duty truck. This solenoid should be energized by the start wire. There are several ways you can rig up to charge the batterys, we use 24v. Run cable from the solenoid directly to the starter and make a jumper from the cable to the small starter connection on the solenoid. This is important because the solenoid needs 24v to hold in properly and not arc internally. With this setup there are no hot wires running through the car except from battery to solenoid, nothing sparks if you touch, nothing shorts out during a run. This setup will last for years with no maintenance. Any of the premium starters will work. Another note on starters, although you may be using a hemi starter, your flywheel almost certainly has a 168 tooth chev ring gear so the starter needs a chev drive.
     
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  14. Mike Canter

    Mike Canter Top Dragster

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    That is how we did it but used the CAT 24 v solenoid. Like said that small jumper on the starter is important.

    I will own up and tell a true story here. In my quest to figure out how to use a 24 v starter system I did not use that jumper on the starter and first did not have a solenoid in line so it was just using the starter solenoid. BAD MOVE. The starter welded the contacts together and it just kept spinning and I could not shut it off. Couldn't open the trunk fast enough because of the rear wing so I had to undo a battery cable connection from a post that went through the firewall. Things were starting to smoke and this cable probably had over a 100 amps of power going through it. My heart was starting to smoke also. Reaching between the frame bars with a metal wrench on a 24 v hot post without welding it is a feat that I am still proud of today;).
     
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  15. sean70ss

    sean70ss Member

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    24v

    I have a diagram if you need one.

    Sean
     
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  16. wcolantuoni

    wcolantuoni Jr. Dragster

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    two motorcycle batteries wired together for 24 volts. We use an industrial 24volt selonoid that can be activated with either + or -. I like to use the - side because it is only one wire to the drivers compartment. I would recommend a heavy duty - ground base. If you need a diagram i could draw one up for you. The two batteries are only 550 cca but they crank all day without a problem.
     
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  17. TADHemiracer

    TADHemiracer Member

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    24 Volt Start Schematic and Battery info

    I use 2 12 volt motorcycle batteries, gives me 12 volt and 24 volt and allows me to use a single 12 volt charger.
    The batteries I use I bought from Batteries Plus, they were Xtreme X2-20L, a 17.5 Ah, CCA 270, about $114 each, 2 year full replacement warrantee. 15 pounds each. 6.8 x 3.4 x 6.1 inches. I can send a schematic to anyone interested. Thanks
     
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  18. TADHemiracer

    TADHemiracer Member

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    24 Volt Start Schematic and Battery info

    Send me your email address so I can send you the attachment showing the schematic for the 12/24 volt system I use. I detailed the type of batteries in a post a few minutes ago.
    Thanks,
    Barry
     
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  19. Shoebox

    Shoebox New Member

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    24V start..

    Hi Barry !
    Thanks a lot for the tip, here is my E-mail: geir.bjonnes@bluezone.no

    Thanks once again
    Geir
     
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  20. dlewis

    dlewis New Member

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    If you would, please send me a copy of your schematics. It would be very much appreciated and thank you in advance.

    David
    Davidlewis77@yahoo.com
     
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